00:00:02.410 - 00:00:17.299

And I'll be sharing and overcoming on the panel. It's really a pleasure to share this panel because it's rare, I think to have panels that sort of fit together quite as well as this one. Uh Let me just speak briefly about our presenters and suggest what

00:00:17.309 - 00:00:32.599

they're gonna be doing and when we leave it to them, uh our first speaker is gonna be a young fellow of my right, uh Henry Anderson. Um and Henry uh got his Masters of Sociology at the University of Hawaii in 1951 and a master in Public

00:00:32.610 - 00:00:54.259

Health Administration at UC Berkeley in 1956. And he was the principal investigator on the Bracero uh health survey in 1956 to 1959 or as it's known, I think now the Suppressed Bracero Health survey, um at least I think he'll explain um an incredible story in and

00:00:54.270 - 00:01:15.279

of itself. He was after suffering really for his honesty, the director of research for the Agricultural Workers Organ Organization Committee of the A FL CIO. Uh It has a number of books, uh Feels of bondage, uh harvest of loneliness and the Bracero program in California. And

00:01:15.290 - 00:01:33.220

he's gonna be speaking about the, the research I did in 19 fifties. And one of the few times we get to hear the actual voices of the uh second speaker uh Valdez, who is a Professor of Chicano Studies and History at the University of Minnesota. And

00:01:33.230 - 00:01:49.160

uh his recent works is uh Barrios Marine uh published by the University of Texas Press, uh A History of the Mexican Midwest. He's also co edited Voices of the New Chicano Chicano History. You should be taking the British. He was working on what a great title,

00:01:50.080 - 00:02:13.119

Growers Schemes and worker dreams, history of organized labor and agriculture between World War Two. and UFW. Uh And uh then, and looking at the a really effective labor movement 10 to set policy and where the CFA sees and work. No. And the last speaker um uh

00:02:13.130 - 00:02:32.679

Philip Gonzalez who is a professor and Director of Labor Studies program at the University of California Irvine. Um And uh his recent work is a Mexican councils and labor organizing CRE politics in the American Southwest, also at the University of Texas Press. And he's working on

00:02:32.690 - 00:02:55.479

a manuscript in a century of Chicano history, empires, nations and on migration. And he'll be speaking primarily on the proposed uh new updated, perfect sanitized everything will be great. Uh the program now uh so past and present I think come together in a better fine way.

00:02:55.630 - 00:03:43.580

But let me start with or that we start it seems to me at the time and it has seemed to me ever since that in the years, 1952 to 1964 there was a wonderful opportunity, an unmatched opportunity for social scientists to investigate a very important problem,

00:03:46.839 - 00:04:11.960

the Bracero program. And that's, I'm going to be talking about the version of that program that existed between those years under what was known as public law of the year. It became a very massive population movement, a controlled movement controlled by the governments of Mexico and

00:04:11.970 - 00:04:39.730

the United States. At its peak, nearly half a million men, we shipped back and forth across the international border. Every year. During the entire life of the program, probably 5 million took part. That's a lot of people. And it wasn't just those men who were affected

00:04:39.739 - 00:05:07.779

by the existence of this system. In the course of uh, my investigations, I found that a heavy majority of them were married men. I found that on average they had four Children. So the program affected not only the 500,000 sos themselves, but their families, Children in

00:05:07.790 - 00:05:34.899

Mexico, there was a great opportunity for somebody to have investigated what the program did to them. But so far as I know nobody did. And then there were the American farm workers who used to do the work that the 500,000 bros did. And there was a

00:05:34.910 - 00:06:01.239

wonderful opportunity for somebody to have been investigated. The question where did they go, what became of them and their families? I don't think anybody did. So that left the third group and those were the Braceros themselves. And somehow or other, it fell my lot to look

00:06:01.250 - 00:06:29.970

into that question. I was a young, a very young guy. We got these two master's degrees. I was trying to put them together in some way. And I met an economist at the University of California at Berkeley named Paul Taylor who was uh kind of the

00:06:29.980 - 00:06:53.690

grand old man of uh Mexican labor studies. He said in so many words, why don't you study the Bracero program? This was 1956. I was very naive. I did not know anything about farm w or I didn't, I had never even heard the word or so.

00:06:54.369 - 00:07:21.839

But uh some are or are we put together a proposal to study one aspect of the Bracero program? That seemed to be uh absolutely non controversial. Uh a study in culture change, as I say, I was trying to bring public health into it in some way.

00:07:22.160 - 00:07:51.119

So uh the basic question to be studied was of braceros undergoing any shift in their ideas about sickness and health as the result of their experience in the United States. And with that emphasis, I was able to get a research grant from the National Institutes of

00:07:51.130 - 00:08:25.429

Health, went forth into the field, hired an interviewer who was himself a Mexican National and uh he had the personality characteristics, which made a very good interview. He was able to enlist people's confidence in a way which not too many people can. So he began selling

00:08:25.440 - 00:08:57.789

me uh completed interviews and uh he would append on the end of them, every interviewee was given the opportunity to comment freely upon anything that had been touched upon earlier. And many of them did. Many of them volunteered comments about things which had not been included

00:08:57.799 - 00:09:24.299

in the questionnaire itself. Having to do with their experiences in Mexico before they were able to get contracts and their experiences on the job and uh, wages and so forth so on. And so we began to add questions to the questionnaire, having to do with these

00:09:24.309 - 00:09:45.869

ancillary matters because we felt that, uh, the privations which they might have gone through in Mexico before they ever get con contracted had something to do with health and, uh, the wages that they earned and the food that they ate, the transportation, the housing in this

00:09:45.880 - 00:10:19.630

country also had something to do with health. So we added these things, um, and many of these, these, uh, anecdotes which were appended to the question were quite disturbing to me. I didn't know that such things existed. So I went down to the reception center in

00:10:19.690 - 00:10:47.739

El Centro where all of the Psoas who came to California and Arizona, uh pass through on their way in and on their way out and observe the first hand the way the men were treated that the people, some 4000 braceros would pass through this one center

00:10:47.750 - 00:11:17.820

every day. And so I just stood to one side and, and looked and observe what it was like. And, uh, it, it pushed me over the edge. Let's put it that way. There were these hundreds of men shuffling past him, a young punk who was selecting

00:11:17.830 - 00:11:49.190

as they could for some, uh, Bracero Users Association in Urban California. He uh we say off the U I won't take you. It was obvious that he was selecting only the uh people that looked as though they might be the most tractable. Um And uh my

00:11:49.640 - 00:12:21.150

mind flashed and what it might have been like in the first half of the 19th century. And another type of labor system involved human beings passing a review in front of somebody else. I, I wrote a state based upon that experience for a friend of mine

00:12:24.580 - 00:12:51.650

who um was so moved by it that he took upon himself to circulate. I had thought it was uh just between the two of us. Um It fell into the hands of representatives of uh the system. I I use that word because it was more than

00:12:51.869 - 00:13:18.789

a program in the usual sense. It involved a powerful industry, agriculture, it involved a number of powerful government agencies and there was an alliance between the two of them. And then I found out that uh the system went even beyond that and it included the University

00:13:18.799 - 00:13:51.179

of California at Berkeley. Make a very long story short. I was ordered to stop the fieldwork. The reason that was given was that the University of California, it's going to be coming before the state legislature of California shortly asking for an appropriation for the coming year.

00:13:52.510 - 00:14:19.900

And the state legislature at that time was heavily dominated by rural senators. And, uh, they were all of course says, a spokesman for it, growers who were but several good. And uh the words that I was given where that they, these cow county senators, it would

00:14:19.909 - 00:14:50.469

make it very embarrassing for the university representatives if in fact, there were somebody on the university payroll who was so critical of this system which growers claim was essential to their third. We have left. Well, I had a sort of moral dilemma as to where the

00:14:50.479 - 00:15:15.440

resign to resign in protest, take it to the media or the AC lu or something. I decided not to. I was allowed to write up the results that we had obtained that far. And uh they were considerable. We had 1149 interviews, not as many as we

00:15:15.450 - 00:15:36.820

had projected, might be needed to uh really illuminate the starting question of whether culture change was taking place or not. But it was more than anybody else had ever done because nobody else had ever tried. So I wrote up a report as best I could on

00:15:36.830 - 00:15:59.039

the basis of these interviews. And, uh, it turned out to be a very long report. Lots of tables, lots of forbidden quotes from these stories that I mentioned, the men were volunteering on their own, putting those two types of evidence together. I thought made a pretty

00:15:59.049 - 00:16:25.789

good report. It was rejected by my, uh, faculty advisors at the university as being too controversial and going too far a field from my starving, a sigh. Once again, I have a dilemma. I was told, well, if you want to on your own time, at this

00:16:25.799 - 00:16:50.849

time, I was no longer university. If you want to on your own time, you can try to prepare a less controversial report, a much shorter report and uh we'll see it. That makes it our problem. Well, once again, I didn't want to waste the three years

00:16:50.859 - 00:17:20.640

of my life that I had spent on the study. And so I did write much truncated, trying to read out some of the more controversial sections that they made use that word. I didn't think they were so bad. Well, this short version was distributed to a

00:17:20.650 - 00:17:45.300

few administrators with the warning that it was being used only by them, not for general distribution. So we now have two versions of the report. One, a big thick one, all the copies were ordered destroyed. I was allowed to keep the 10 and later on, I

00:17:45.310 - 00:18:15.670

ran off a few and uh with the help of friends collated them. It's, it's not an easy job. It was 750 pages. So there was that version and then there was the truncated version uh which was for limited administrative use, only blood care. Eventually, that was

00:18:15.680 - 00:18:35.050

published by the Arnold Press as part of its series of Chicago History and copies of that may be available here and there, the longer report is not, it's available only in my own files. And I sent a couple and I say I'm gonna address some later

00:18:35.079 - 00:19:00.050

on, I sent a couple of them to the Library of Congress in order to get a copyright. So if anybody wants to go to Washington DC there, but now back to the present day, I think that what we found in that study be very profoundly upon

00:19:00.329 - 00:19:28.079

the uh social policy question which is now being discussed, which I take it is going to be voted on in Congress within a few months. And that is the so-called Guest Worker program uh which seems to be some primarily some the in the Fox, but George

00:19:28.089 - 00:19:52.660

Bush is also quite enthusiastic about it and it has some allies including some strange bed colors as I understand it, I think Bill is gonna be talking about that. So let's just go down some of the arguments that are being used favor of the so-called Guest

00:19:52.670 - 00:20:28.569

worker program. Fox likes to use the word regularized, normalized stabilize whatever um part of his plan has to do with amnesty. And that I encountered the pro and he also talks about the guest worker aspect of the plan, bringing uh order out of the chaos of

00:20:28.579 - 00:21:00.050

the farm labor market. It's supposed to stop the uh the movement of illegals. Well, in our study of the B code and action, it was also supposed to accomplish that but it didn't. Um we had many men fell us that if they weren't able to get

00:21:00.060 - 00:21:21.319

a contract, some of them were rejected for health reasons. There was thousands rejected every year and they didn't want to return to their villages. Most of them have gone heavily into debt. In order of the secret contract, they had no way of paying off those debts

00:21:22.589 - 00:21:50.339

other than Detroit, that would get work in the United States and so many of them did come back. Has your liquids? Another argument used in favor of the so-called Guest worker program was that uh is that the men will learn new skills? They will learn what

00:21:50.349 - 00:22:15.550

uh Fox likes to call the entrepreneurial spirit and they will return to Mexico and uh with these new skills with this new spirit, with lots and lots of money that they're gonna take home with them, they will start a whole new sort of economic development in

00:22:15.560 - 00:22:42.520

Mexico. Well, he asked among other many other questions, have you learned anything in the United States that you can take back with you and put to good use in Mexico and we had uh maybe one or two who said yes, lo said, oh, let's see. I,

00:22:43.050 - 00:23:09.609

I promised that I would let the service speak before I finish. I'm gonna try to deliver on that one. Oh, I hear you. If you go down to Mexico to look for changes, you are going to be disappointed. I come from Jalisco all around our little

00:23:09.619 - 00:23:35.739

towns, farming towns, most of the men have been coming to the United States. As Braceros, there have been no changes, not in farming methods, not in anything else. The only change is that the land is idle now. And uh another thing that you hear is that

00:23:35.750 - 00:24:09.689

this brave new program is going to serve as a part of the good neighbor policy between the two countries. So we asked questions along this line. Uh For example, have you had any contacts with Americans outside of your the camp where you live and the fields

00:24:09.699 - 00:24:38.969

where you work? And about 3/4 said that they had had no contact at all and uh of those who had so the con had the contacts had been limited to Spanish speaking, storekeepers, bar owners and things like that. And uh so I think it was safe

00:24:38.979 - 00:24:58.250

to conclude they had learned very little about the United States and we ended the questionnaire by asking, what do you think you will remember longest about the United States? Well, in my paper, I have about half a dozen so I can't read all these quotes. I'll

00:24:58.260 - 00:25:20.849

just end with this one. This will be my last trip to the United States. I would rather stay in Mexico. Earn little but be a free and happy man. The United States is going to be a bad place. They treat us like animals. All they lack

00:25:20.939 - 00:25:53.760

are the whips. Delighted to be here but to be on the panel with such distinguished and uh marvelous people. Uh people who realize that scholarship goes beyond the little books that we write in the articles that we do.

00:25:54.229 - 00:26:12.040

Um my concern in uh this project of, of which the talk is part um is to bring to center stage, the two main protagonists in the struggle over the best program of 42,004. And in spite of all the literature, it is organized agriculture, the American Farm

00:26:12.219 - 00:26:27.500

Federation against the A FL and the CIO. And if you look at it any other way, you're missing the struggle, uh you might get something else out of it and there's a lot else going on. The program begins in World War Two and it is predicated

00:26:27.510 - 00:26:46.319

on uh who can make a more convincing argument with their friends, namely the A FL and CIO Unions or uh the Farm Bureau Federation and its allies on whether or not a labor shortage exists, if it exists. Uh should a program be instituted? Um and the

00:26:46.349 - 00:27:06.510

uh agriculture um and railroad industries cried the loudest of all employers and they got most workers uh very simply. Uh a number of labor leaders spoke vigorously. Uh Apart from the brotherhood of maintenance of way workers, that is the railroad work. And uh there really wasn't

00:27:06.520 - 00:27:26.589

much going on in uh organized labor. And therefore the program got instituted. We can note that at that time, uh The A FL and the CIO were practically more of them than agriculture. The old A Pao of the CIO had pretty much dropped out of agriculture

00:27:26.599 - 00:27:45.930

by 1938. And it even uh sort of expelled the Southern China Farmers Union, which at the time was independent and it claimed that nationwide, there was not a labor shortage, there were localized shortages that could be met by uh sending workers from areas where unemployment and

00:27:45.939 - 00:28:01.780

underemployment still were quite substantial, mainly in the South where it was strong. Uh And they could set up a hiring hall program that would work very effectively to uh work uh with the best friends, they hadn't organized labor, namely the meat cutters, uh the amalgamated meat

00:28:01.790 - 00:28:15.579

cutters and butcher workers union uh to send workers to canneries in New Jersey and they even worked in Stockton, California uh where workers were sent under contract and the employers were very happy about that program. It's pretty clear that it could have worked much more broadly.

00:28:15.589 - 00:28:30.180

That is uh there was no need for a Bracero program even during the worst labor shortages in 1943 in the aftermath of the war, that is from roughly 46 to 51. We've got another stage in the program and the question is what is gonna happen to

00:28:30.189 - 00:28:46.670

it? Is it gonna survive in that? And again, I will argue that it hinged on organized labor and its own unions. Uh Both the railway and the agricultural employers cried very loud that there was still a labor shortage around but the maintenance of labor workers uh

00:28:47.020 - 00:29:04.239

were very adamant in saying no, there's no labor shortage. Uh And they got the program shut down in 1946 in agriculture. Uh Neither the A FL nor the CIO had an effective union at the time. So there was a renewal in August of, I'm sorry. Uh

00:29:04.250 - 00:29:23.880

July of 1946 the following month in August, 1946 the stfu uh then joined the A FL uh as the National Farm Labor Union. Uh And from that point on continued to make uh an argument that uh lasted for its own lifetime through 1960. 1st of all

00:29:24.410 - 00:29:39.520

that, uh they wanted to reform, they want an abolition of the program that there would be a need for public hearing to determine the need that is uh rather than the secret and what it called conspiratorial dealings involving growers as well as the United States and

00:29:39.530 - 00:29:58.089

Mexican governments. It also demanded that there be a wage scale that was negotiated between union and employers, uh that there'd be equal pay and equal conditions for the United States citizen as well as Mexican workers, that undocumented workers would be banned. Uh, and that Braceros had

00:29:58.099 - 00:30:15.109

a right to join the union of their choice and have that union negotiate their wages and employment. And again, that's a consistent argument through all the various renewals that generally take place approximately to two years afterwards. Um, now, uh, it failed to get, uh, a convincing,

00:30:15.119 - 00:30:31.180

uh, period pretty much, uh, for much of its history. And in fact, uh, the National Foreign Labor Union was crippled, uh, through the late forties and early fifties for a lot of reasons. Um, the ball, uh, struggled in uh, the fields. Uh, it had a couple

00:30:31.189 - 00:30:50.709

of major strikes. One, running from 1947 to 1950 probably his best known strike against the Digeorgio Corporation. Again, Di Georgia had been struck many times in the thirties and DFW uh, made it a cost and in 1966 airstrike gained tremendous support from, uh, the labor movement

00:30:50.719 - 00:31:08.020

at the time if gained support from workers including Braceros who even refused to cross the union to get line. Uh, but the government administration and the courts failed to act according to the letter of the law on many occasions, including the starting attack Hartney Act. Uh,

00:31:08.030 - 00:31:23.989

they threatened Braceros with deportation if they didn't return to work and they allowed undocumented workers to return. So basically, the government again is involved in a pretty quick conspiracy. The last phase of which is a house subcomittee investigating the Di Georgia strike, uh which came to

00:31:24.000 - 00:31:40.670

California. And in the appendix of those hearings, the so called word report took place and it was vicious and libelous and inaccurate, the kind of things you'd expect during the best ever program. I think this is pretty well documented. Uh It was uh signed by a

00:31:40.680 - 00:31:58.729

number of uh people we know about including an up and coming aspiring congressman Richard Milhouse Nixon. Uh that was the first place where he kind of gained uh great attention that Georgia distributed this widely. And as uh the leaders of the national labor union said, everybody

00:31:58.739 - 00:32:15.989

believed that including the allies in organized labor and that killed the strike. Uh by 1950. Uh it was a three year strike again, it was a major strike in part as a result of what went on during that strike as well as other events. Uh probably

00:32:16.000 - 00:32:34.040

the most important of which uh was an incident that took place uh in El Paso and Juarez in late 1948 in October, the so called uh El Paso incident in which the Miga allowed approximately 7000 undocumented Mexican workers to come into the country in order to

00:32:34.050 - 00:32:49.170

keep negotiations at that time to keep the wages lower uh during the best settle program, organized labor at that time turned toward undocumented workers. And that's when the Wet Back campaigns so called wet back campaigns took place. It was primarily in response to that. It was

00:32:49.180 - 00:33:05.000

like there have been other years going on and it was a seven year campaign that in the beginning and uh and you know, around late 47 lasted until 1954 when so-called operation we that took place, the major focus was to remove undocumented workers and to deport

00:33:05.010 - 00:33:20.310

them. And that year in 1954 over a million were deported. And that ended one of the phases. Uh And as a union and the labor movement viewed it at the time. It was a success again. I think that the later implications of uh hit it in

00:33:20.319 - 00:33:42.989

the face. Uh And uh apart from that, uh we can still say that at that time, organized labor is pretty disorganized and is poorly informed and it's so poorly informed, so poorly organized that uh public law 78 renewed the Bracero program in 1951. Uh And the

00:33:43.000 - 00:33:58.069

A FL and the CIO in spite of their opposition, still continued only to seek reform. Notice to say there are ways to change it to make it work well. And that same year in 51 the National Friend Labor Union was probably its most important strike in

00:33:58.079 - 00:34:17.708

terms of organizing workers in the Imperial Valley, which focused on undocumented workers and it was so corrupt that um the Growers Association, uh uh one of its members, one of its most influential members, his brother was the Mexican uh ambassador who uh didn't hold Braceros or

00:34:17.718 - 00:34:31.753

didn't pull them from the fields in the strike. That is again, tremendously corrupt kind of thing against all the laws and everything like that. That pretty much which killed the union for labor organizing notice from that time forward. Uh The uh renamed National Agriculture Workers Union

00:34:31.763 - 00:34:48.858

just a year later, didn't go into the fields and practically did nothing. Uh That was uh that second big, big strike. Uh pretty much killed it. And from that point, uh again, a low point around uh 1951 1952 I would argue that from the ashes of

00:34:48.898 - 00:35:05.099

the phoenix arose. Uh That is the attack on the Bracero program came from within organized labor before all the other stuff we all read about. Uh And two of the biggest things are institutionalized. That is uh both the CIO and the A FL uh convinced uh

00:35:05.108 - 00:35:22.989

the uh Bureau of Employment Security to the EFC to form the labor Advisory committee to the BS C to deal with the Foreign Placement Service. And that's in 1952. Again, the time that things aren't very bright at all the following year in 1953 again, the CIO

00:35:23.000 - 00:35:37.600

and the A FL formed the United States section of the Joint US Mexico trade Union Committee. And the specific purpose is to advise the United States Department of Labor on the press of a program as much as providing advice to the government. I think more important

00:35:37.610 - 00:35:54.169

part of it is that it provides education to the labor movement. And that, that is where uh a number of campaigns take place in the middle fifties and the late fifties that permit um especially uh by about 57 even more. So, uh 1958 59 a number

00:35:54.179 - 00:36:13.969

of public church uh uh and uh labor committees, uh student committees for and again, they're clustered at a time when uh the nation uh is turning a little bit to the moderate liberal. Uh tr uh and I think that is within the labor movement. That's very

00:36:13.979 - 00:36:32.239

important. The second feature of change during this low point uh takes place in 1954 and 55. And it's related to the mechanization of jobs uh in uh the uh packing of lettuce and a few other vegetables uh which uh they have a devastating effect on the

00:36:32.250 - 00:36:47.560

packing house workers where workers were organized in the sheds and it displaces them, sends them into the fields and braceros take over their jobs. And as a result of that, the CIO component of organized labor comes in and gets systematic about doing something about the Bracero

00:36:47.709 - 00:37:05.000

program. And from that time forward, you'll see the A FL and the CIO which merged in 1955 working together on the program. So organized labor is coming together. Uh And it speaks with a fairly united uh voice. Uh in particular, I would argue that because all

00:37:05.010 - 00:37:23.429

those factions are together by 1959. Um It permits organized labor uh ultimately to get to George Green to make, make two decisions that, that are very important very early that year. Uh First, uh to find demand for the termination of the Fetto program rather than its

00:37:23.439 - 00:37:39.699

reform. And that begins in 59. And pretty consistently, you'll see the second decision, namely the decision to try to get all the factions of the old A FL and CIO unions together, which is what a woc is supposed to be to uh engage in an organizing

00:37:39.709 - 00:37:53.679

drive. Now, I would argue that both of those efforts take about five years to be realized. And again, a lot of people get beat up along the way, including the National Agricultural Workers Union. Uh the likes of who is again a hero for a lot of

00:37:53.689 - 00:38:07.189

us for many reasons, in spite of his many problems. Uh and he had a bad attitude, I think for the uh for the, the operation *** and things like that. But again, within the context of not being able to do anything, not being able to move

00:38:07.199 - 00:38:27.139

uh the uh federation, which is a part, uh he's kind of stuck, but certainly by 1960 organized growers realized that the program is in trouble. And um, so, um you'll see them complaining and crying and uh and struggling quite a bit. Um It's evident that um

00:38:27.250 - 00:38:45.205

uh the handwriting is on the wall. Uh And even by 1962 the Dior uh corporation again, the one that had defeated the, um NFL U States very clearly. California agriculture has ahead of it. The toughest battle from outside forces that it has yet to face. So

00:38:45.215 - 00:39:03.169

it's more afraid of this campaign than it is uh against the strike of the National Foreign Labor Union that lasted three years against it by October 1964 when the Bracero program is uh just on the end of uh its uh uh existence. Uh Jack Pickett who

00:39:03.179 - 00:39:18.300

uh people who read the Koran Farm, which is the Farm Bureau publication of uh uh California asserted at that time again, this is two months before the Bracero program is to end. Uh This is my favorite quote, of course. Um We have taken one of the

00:39:18.310 - 00:39:35.030

fairest and most equitable pieces of legislation ever put on the books and walked away from it by cowards. Our sellout to the stupidity of the labor leaders is so complete that we must now scrap all for a substitute, not only to save our biggest industry, but

00:39:35.040 - 00:39:53.629

also to help protect the jobs of the very union men who endorsed the nonsense that Braceros were displacing domestic help. Um So, uh anyway, the program dies and precisely the next year, the A wo campaign is renewed uh in that citizens for Cesar Chavez and some

00:39:53.639 - 00:40:10.324

short lived victories in the late 19 sixties and 19 seventies. Um I would argue again, uh in conclusion that uh within organized labor, only a very small number of unions are consistently engaged in the struggle over the, over the best program. And that was the Southern

00:40:10.334 - 00:40:27.225

Kent Farmers Union and successors. Uh Secondly, the railway uh railway Brotherhood uh through levy amalgamated meat cutters. Uh And lastly, the hacking house workers, that is the rest of organized labor, pretty much is on the sidelines. And that includes uh uh uh the recent work here

00:40:27.235 - 00:40:43.979

that is uh Walter Ruther was on the sidelines too and he was a coward. Um This suggests, I would, I would say a very important structural weakness of the labor movement in dealing with an issue like this. Um its inability to focus uh sufficiently on worker

00:40:43.989 - 00:41:01.790

education as well as broader implications for the labor movement when workers remained unorganized. Uh which again, I would say is very much in keeping with its philosophy of catering primarily to members in their immediate interests rather than to collective interest of workers. Uh They didn't realize

00:41:01.800 - 00:41:18.520

there'd be so many Mexicans around. Uh And uh we're here. So again, it's short sighted and I think it's a real substantial thing. Uh The entire movement uh isn't very much, I guess that's basically the problem And again, the biggest difficulty that happened is that there

00:41:18.530 - 00:41:38.004

is not a stable union in agriculture throughout this entire period. And as a result of that organized labor uh trouncing uh organized uh I'm sorry, organized agriculture keeps trouncing organized labor, uh working conditions uh go down terribly. Uh And uh basically, uh they can continue to

00:41:38.014 - 00:41:59.800

argue, argue for the sanctity of the American farmer uh real nicely. Um It is clear that organized labor in this case, however, did develop a coherent program. Uh It brought its allies together and it was able to develop an unstable but successful coalition uh that ultimately

00:41:59.810 - 00:42:38.409

gained broad public support and even government support and enough allies to ultimately shape what seemed like an Impenetrable shield of corporation agriculture. So, well, a couple of tough acts to follow, um I followed Henry's work and um fact, I've interviewed and I uh I'm very glad

00:42:38.419 - 00:43:02.899

that you brought this out because as you said, we're some of us feel secure in um uh 10 having tenure academic freedom, but I think it's a very tenuous uh and very uh uh on the weekend, but guarantee um that uh that guarantee can be taken

00:43:02.909 - 00:43:19.500

away very easily. Um And in the case of Henry was taken away and not only his right to work, but uh all of the work that he carried out, but um I'm gonna change the subject somewhat and look at the recent discussions of the guest worker

00:43:19.510 - 00:43:36.169

program and I should give you a little bit of history behind the work that I, that I, uh I just, I'm going to talk about a much, uh I just finished with Raul Hernandez, uh a book on Chicano History entitled, which is called Chicano History. A

00:43:36.179 - 00:44:03.330

century of Chicano history. Empires. Nations of migration. And um what our basic argument here is that the United States is an empire and in empire, we in the, in the classical sense, the United States is behaving as all empires. They seek to dominate other nations and

00:44:03.340 - 00:44:21.209

to have those nations serve. It's perceived itself in, in our estimation, the United States has inherited the mantle and it's acting in that way. And that kind of thinking is so far away from conventional lives in the United States that it's like talking to the law,

00:44:21.360 - 00:44:42.179

sometimes this picture. Uh Well, uh I'm not the only one popular American empire. I'm looking at the behavior and the actions of the also the United States as imperial. Um Recently, a syndicated article came out by William Rusher who happens to be the editor of the

00:44:42.189 - 00:45:01.360

National Review, his bottom line and he came up and said, so what if a lot of people around the world don't like us? We have, we are the most powerful nation on earth. We have inherited the position of the British Empire and we have to carry

00:45:01.370 - 00:45:17.100

out that uh responsibility uh because it is our responsibility to use that power in such a way we bring out, we bring the world to border either. And he said that's what the British did. That's what the Romans did now, that's what we got to do.

00:45:17.110 - 00:45:36.489

And he referred to the United States as the imp uh the second piece I was referring to uh to demonstrate or not that far is a piece by William Max Max Booth who happens to be the editor of uh one of the, of the editor, an

00:45:36.500 - 00:45:58.719

editorialist for the Wall Street Journal, who just editor edited or wrote a key uh article in the Weekly Standard, which is another very conservative uh publication. The title that uh weekly is the case for the American Empire to which they just come up and say this

00:45:59.260 - 00:46:21.040

fitting ourselves. We are the latest versions of Empire. Um I think the far right, however, is saying we should just accept the fact that we a vampire act. Um I think my feeling is we have to look at what Empire has done in an institution. In

00:46:21.050 - 00:46:39.629

that book. We look at 100 years of migration and we situated within the context of the American Empire, you will carry out that migration from the early 19 hundreds to the present. You look at the guest worker program and all the discussion around the guest worker

00:46:39.649 - 00:46:59.600

program in the context of this economic empire, the economic domination exercised by the United States over Mexico. We go first to the early 19th, early 20th century, late 19th century in our book. And we look at the actions or the social consequences of the railroad railroad

00:46:59.610 - 00:47:16.669

building and address in Topeka Center, Southern Pacific Union, Pacific JJ JP Morgan and others who are investing in the railroad in Mexico in the 18 seventies uh into and build the Mexican railroad system. Then we look at the mining industry and we find out that the

00:47:16.679 - 00:47:17.500

mining industry.